Juliana Stepanova: Trust Over Escalation — A Patient Approach to Difficult PO Relationships

“The team still believes it could be solved with proper communication to the PO. My idea is to really try, in a supportive way, to build trust, to encourage communication, and to come to the solution as a team altogether. This is like a win-win situation.” – Juliana Stepanova

Juliana brings a challenge that many Scrum Masters will recognize: a Product Owner who doesn’t want to be coached and whose behaviors are undermining Scrum rituals. The situation is complicated by organizational structure—the Scrum Master reports to the people department while the PO reports to the product department, creating misaligned directions with no common leadership thread.

The PO arrives at refinement meetings unprepared, writing user stories on the spot while eight team members sit idle for hours. When Juliana explores the root cause, she discovers the PO is genuinely overwhelmed with responsibilities outside the team. But here’s the twist: this newly promoted PO is proud of the role and resistant to accepting help, preferring to say “just wait, I will manage it.”

Rather than escalating—which Juliana notes would damage trust for years or potentially lose the PO entirely—she advocates for a patient, collaborative approach. The experiment she designs focuses on engaging more deeply with the PO’s activities to understand which tasks could be delegated or eliminated, while continuing to build trust through support rather than confrontation. The team maintains hope that the PO will eventually accept help, choosing persistence over escalation.

In this segment, we talk about coaching Product Owners and building trust.

Self-reflection Question: When facing a resistant stakeholder, do you default to escalation, or do you invest in building the trust that enables genuine collaboration?

Transform Your Agile Teams with Hard-Earned Lessons from Super-Experienced Scrum Masters

Do you wish you had decades of experience? Learn from the Best Scrum Masters In The World, Today! The Tips from the Trenches – Scrum Master edition audiobook includes hours of audio interviews with SM’s that have decades of experience: from Mike Cohn to Linda Rising, Christopher Avery, and many more. Super-experienced Scrum Masters share their hard-earned lessons with you. Learn those today, make your teams awesome!

About Juliana Stepanova

Juliana Stepanova

Juliana is an Agile coach and Scrum master, with a focus in her work on transformation through people and processes rather than the other way round. She helps teams and leaders to create clarity, build trust and create value with purpose. Her work combines structure with empathy and is always focused on real collaboration and meaningful results.

You can link with Juliana Stepanova on LinkedIn.

You can also follow Juliana on Twitter.

BONUS: From Waterfall to Flow—Rethinking Mental Models in Software Delivery With Henrik Mårtensson

In this BONUS episode, we explore the origins and persistence of waterfall methodology in software development with management consultant Henrik Mårtensson. Based on an article where he details the history of Waterfall, Henrik explains the historical context of waterfall, challenges the mental models that keep it alive in modern organizations, and offers insights into how systems thinking can transform our approach to software delivery. This conversation is essential for anyone looking to understand why outdated methodologies persist and how to move toward more effective approaches to software development.

The True Origins of Waterfall

“Waterfall came from the SAGE project, the first large software project in history, where they came up with a methodology based on an economic analysis.”

Henrik takes us on a fascinating historical journey to uncover the true origins of waterfall methodology. Contrary to popular belief, the waterfall approach wasn’t invented by Winston Royce but emerged from the SAGE project in the 1950s. Bennington published the original paper outlining this approach, while it was Bell and Tayer who later named it “waterfall” when referencing Royce’s work. Henrik explains how gated process models eventually led to the formalized waterfall methodology and points out that an entire generation of methods existed between waterfall and modern Agile approaches that are often overlooked in the conversation.

In this segment we refer to:

Mental Models That Keep Us Stuck

“Fredrik Taylor’s model of work missed the concept of a system, leading us to equate busyness with productivity.”

Continue reading BONUS: From Waterfall to Flow—Rethinking Mental Models in Software Delivery With Henrik Mårtensson

Substack Week: Why Product Management is Broken and How to Fix It With Anton Zaides

In this SPECIAL Substack Week episode, we dive deep into the current state of product management with Anton Zaides, a seasoned software engineer and leader. Anton shares his perspectives on why product management is fundamentally broken and offers practical solutions for organizations looking to improve their product development processes.

The Journey to Engineering Leadership

“I started to search for content from other engineering managers and focused on practical insights.”

Anton’s journey spans 15 years in software engineering, from game development to DevOps and scaling startups. His transition to leadership revealed a gap in practical leadership content, which inspired him to start sharing his own experiences. Drawing from his four years as an engineering leader in a startup, Anton noticed patterns in product management that needed addressing, leading to his viral article on the topic.

The Broken State of Product Management

“My team was working on a feature, that got canceled the day after it was released.”

Continue reading Substack Week: Why Product Management is Broken and How to Fix It With Anton Zaides

Saravana Bharathi on the importance of influencing people

Influencing people is a key skill for Scrum Masters. Politics are alive and kicking in all organizations, and we must be aware and able to deal with that phenomenon. Therefore it is important to know how to work with all stakeholders, at all levels, including those involved in the political structures of the organization.
Savarana introduces two Harvard Business Review articles that explain that politics are a natural part of any human organization:
What everyone should know about office politics
Office politics is just influence by another name
A book that Scrum Masters can read to learn more about how to work with stakeholders and gain their cooperation is Dale Carnegie’s How to Win Friends and Influence People, a must read that has been referred to before on the podcast.

About Saravana Bharathi

Saravana started AgileKarma.com, a site dedicated to sharing better ways to develop software. His goal: to inspire other to share their ideas and experiences as well 🙂 Which is exactly what we do here on the podcast.
Saravana is a seasoned software development professional with over 15 years of experience in Aerospace, Banking and Insurance domains.
You can find Saravana Bharathi on twitter, and link with Saravana Bharathi on Linkedin.

Enter e-mail to download a clickable PO Cheat Sheet
This handy Coach Your PO cheat-sheet includes questions to help you define the problem, and links to handy, easy techniques to help you coach your Product Owner
Enter e-mail to download a clickable PO Cheat Sheet
This handy Coach Your PO cheat-sheet includes questions to help you define the problem, and links to handy, easy techniques to help you coach your Product Owner
Enter e-mail to download a checklist to help your PO manage their time
This simple checklist and calendar handout, with a coaching article will help you define the minimum enagement your PO must have with the team
Enter e-mail to download a checklist to help your PO manage their time
This simple checklist and calendar handout, with a coaching article will help you define the minimum enagement your PO must have with the team
Internal Conference
Checklist
Internal Conference
Checklist
Download a detailed How-To to help measure success for your team
Motivate your team with the right metrics, and the right way to visualize and track them. Marcus presents a detailed How-To document based on his experience at The Bungsu Hospital
Download a detailed How-To to help measure success for your team
Read about Visualization and TRANSFORM The way your team works
A moving story of how work at the Bungsu Hospital was transformed by a simple tool that you can use to help your team.
Read about Visualization and TRANSFORM The way your team works
Overcome Team Resistance and Gain Leadership Buy-In
Discover practical, real-world solutions from leading Agile practitioners. Download three free chapters from 'Tips from the Trenches Scrum Master Edition' and start transforming your Agile practices today!
Overcome Team Resistance and Gain Leadership Buy-In
Discover practical, real-world solutions from leading Agile practitioners. Access three free chapters from 'Tips from the Trenches Scrum Master Edition' and start transforming your Agile practices today!
Overcome Team Resistance and Gain Leadership Buy-In
Discover practical, real-world solutions from leading Agile practitioners. Download three free chapters from 'Tips from the Trenches Scrum Master Edition' and start transforming your Agile practices today!
FREE! Audiobook Chapters: Overcome Team Resistance and Gain Leadership Buy-In
Download three free chapters from 'Tips from the Trenches Scrum Master Edition' and start transforming your Agile practices today!
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