Imagine a company that spends a year building an iPad app—and on launch day the product owner says: “Now it’ll be interesting to see if anyone uses it.” In this episode, Marcus Hammarberg and Tore Fjaertoft share why organizations keep installing frameworks like software, why it still doesn’t work, and what they’ve learned from places like Spotify about treating your way of working as a product in itself.
When Copying Without Adopting Becomes the Norm
“It becomes more about following whatever this framework tells you to do, rather than to understand what the problem you’re trying to solve is all about.”
Marcus and Tore met at a consultancy in Malmö and within 15 minutes realized they shared the same frustrations—despite coming from opposite directions. Marcus comes from the ground up as a software developer and coach, while Tore works top-down with leadership teams on product organization design. Both had worked at Spotify and both had seen organizations copy famous frameworks and models without adopting the underlying mindset. The telltale sign, as Tore describes it, is when people focus on compliance rather than being pragmatic—following the manual without questioning whether the way they’re working is actually serving the organization. As Marcus frames it through Cynefin, product development lives in a domain where best practices don’t even exist—only emergent practices that you discover by trying things out.
The Great Product Owner: Opening Up to the Team for Solutions
“The PO who’s not sitting and saying ‘I know how it’s right, I will solve it by myself,’ but coming and saying ‘Hey, let’s think all together’—that’s what gives very, very speed-up development into becoming a great PO.” – Juliana Stepanova
Juliana describes the Product Owners she considers truly great as those who bring their challenges to the team rather than solving everything alone. Her example features a PO who was invited to recurring release meetings that consumed one and a half to two hours every two weeks—30 people in a room, largely a waste of time. Instead of suffering in silence or trying to fix it alone, this PO approached the team: “Hey guys, I have these meetings, and they’re useless for me. How can we deal with that?” The team collaborated with the Scrum Master to explore multiple options.
Together, they developed a streamlined, semi-automatic system that reduced the process to 10 minutes without requiring anyone to sit in a room. This solution was so effective that it was eventually adopted across the entire company, eliminating countless hours of wasted meetings. The key insight: great POs see themselves as part of the team, not above it. They’re open to solutions from anyone and understand that collaboration—not individual genius—drives real improvements.
Self-reflection Question: When facing challenges that seem outside the team’s domain, do you bring them to the team for collaborative problem-solving, or do you try to solve them alone?
The Bad Product Owner: The Loner Who Does Everyone’s Job
“To make it quicker, I will skip asking the designer, I will directly put it by myself. I learned how to design five years ago. But afterwards, it’s neglecting the whole team—you don’t take into account the UX, and actually you need to rework.” – Juliana Stepanova
The anti-pattern Juliana sees most frequently is the “loner” PO—someone who takes on other roles to move faster. The classic example: a PO who bypasses the UX/UI designer because “I learned design five years ago, I’ll just do it myself.” This behavior seems efficient in the moment but creates multiple problems. It disrespects the expertise of team members, undermines the collaborative nature of agile development, and almost inevitably leads to rework when the shortcuts create quality gaps.
Juliana points out this isn’t unique to POs—developers sometimes bypass testers for the same “efficiency” reasons. The solution isn’t punishment but cultural reinforcement: helping people see the value of professional work, encouraging communication and openness, and building respect for each role’s contribution. The key principle: if someone hasn’t asked for help, don’t assume they need yours. Focus on your own job, and offer assistance only when invited or when you explicitly ask “Do you need help?”
Self-reflection Question: When have you taken on someone else’s role because it seemed faster, and what was the real cost of that shortcut?
Transform Your Agile Teams with Hard-Earned Lessons from Super-Experienced Scrum Masters
Do you wish you had decades of experience? Learn from the Best Scrum Masters In The World, Today!The Tips from the Trenches – Scrum Master edition audiobook includes hours of audio interviews with SM’s that have decades of experience: from Mike Cohn to Linda Rising, Christopher Avery, and many more. Super-experienced Scrum Masters share their hard-earned lessons with you. Learn those today, make your teams awesome!
About Juliana Stepanova
Juliana is an Agile coach and Scrum master, with a focus in her work on transformation through people and processes rather than the other way round. She helps teams and leaders to create clarity, build trust and create value with purpose. Her work combines structure with empathy and is always focused on real collaboration and meaningful results.
“The team still believes it could be solved with proper communication to the PO. My idea is to really try, in a supportive way, to build trust, to encourage communication, and to come to the solution as a team altogether. This is like a win-win situation.” – Juliana Stepanova
Juliana brings a challenge that many Scrum Masters will recognize: a Product Owner who doesn’t want to be coached and whose behaviors are undermining Scrum rituals. The situation is complicated by organizational structure—the Scrum Master reports to the people department while the PO reports to the product department, creating misaligned directions with no common leadership thread.
The PO arrives at refinement meetings unprepared, writing user stories on the spot while eight team members sit idle for hours. When Juliana explores the root cause, she discovers the PO is genuinely overwhelmed with responsibilities outside the team. But here’s the twist: this newly promoted PO is proud of the role and resistant to accepting help, preferring to say “just wait, I will manage it.”
Rather than escalating—which Juliana notes would damage trust for years or potentially lose the PO entirely—she advocates for a patient, collaborative approach. The experiment she designs focuses on engaging more deeply with the PO’s activities to understand which tasks could be delegated or eliminated, while continuing to build trust through support rather than confrontation. The team maintains hope that the PO will eventually accept help, choosing persistence over escalation.
Self-reflection Question: When facing a resistant stakeholder, do you default to escalation, or do you invest in building the trust that enables genuine collaboration?
Transform Your Agile Teams with Hard-Earned Lessons from Super-Experienced Scrum Masters
Do you wish you had decades of experience? Learn from the Best Scrum Masters In The World, Today!The Tips from the Trenches – Scrum Master edition audiobook includes hours of audio interviews with SM’s that have decades of experience: from Mike Cohn to Linda Rising, Christopher Avery, and many more. Super-experienced Scrum Masters share their hard-earned lessons with you. Learn those today, make your teams awesome!
About Juliana Stepanova
Juliana is an Agile coach and Scrum master, with a focus in her work on transformation through people and processes rather than the other way round. She helps teams and leaders to create clarity, build trust and create value with purpose. Her work combines structure with empathy and is always focused on real collaboration and meaningful results.
How can engineers leverage AI to write better code—and think like architects to build systems that truly scale? In this episode, Brian Childress, a CTO and software architect with over 15 years of experience, shares hard-won lessons from teams using AI coding tools daily, and explains why the real challenge isn’t just writing code—it’s designing systems that scale with users, features, and teams.
The Complexity Trap: When AI Multiplies Our Problems
“Most engineering projects and software engineers themselves lean more towards complexity, and I find that that complexity really is multiplied when we bring in the power of AI and its ability to write just tons and tons and tons of code.”
Brian has observed a troubling pattern: AI tools can generate deeply nested components with complex data flows that technically work but are nearly impossible to understand or maintain. When teams don’t guide AI through architectural decisions, they end up with code that becomes “a little too complex for us to understand what is actually going on here.” The speed at which AI produces code makes understanding the underlying problem even more critical—we can solve problems quickly, but we must ensure we’re solving them the right way.
In this powerful conversation, former fighter pilot Christian “Boo” Boucousis reveals how military precision translates into agile business leadership. We explore the FLEX model (Plan-Brief-Execute-Debrief), the critical difference between control-based and awareness-based leadership, and why most organizations fail to truly embrace iterative thinking.
From Cockpit to Boardroom: An Unexpected Journey
“I learned over time that it doesn’t matter what you do if you’re always curious, and you’re always intentional, and you’re always asking questions.” — Christian “Boo” Boucousis
Christian’s path from fighter pilot to leadership consultant wasn’t planned—it was driven by necessity and curiosity. After 11 years as a fighter pilot (7 in Australia, 4 in the UK), an autoimmune condition ended his flying career at age 30. Rather than accepting a comfy job flying politicians around, he chose entrepreneurship. He moved to Afghanistan with a friend and built a reconstruction company that grew to a quarter billion dollars in four years. The secret? The debrief skills he learned as a fighter pilot. By constantly asking “What are you trying to achieve? How’s it going? Why is there a gap?” he approached business with an agile mindset before he even knew what agile was. This curiosity-driven, question-focused approach became the foundation for everything that followed.
The FLEX Model: Plan-Brief-Execute-Debrief
“Agile and scrum were co-created by John Sutherland, who was a fighter pilot, and its origins sit in the OODA loop and iteration. Which is why it’s a circle.” — Christian “Boo” Boucousis
The FLEX model isn’t new—fighter pilots have used this Plan-Brief-Execute-Debrief cycle for 60 years. It’s the ultimate simple agile model, designed to help teams accelerate toward goals using the same accelerated learning curve the Air Force uses to train fighter pilots. The key insight: everything in this model is iterative, not linear. Every mission has a start, middle, and end, and every stage involves constant adaptation. Afterburner (the company Christian now leads as CEO) has worked with nearly 3,800 companies and 2.8 million people over 30 years, teaching this model. What’s fascinating is that the DNA of agile is baked into fighter pilot thinking—John Sutherland, co-creator of Scrum, wrote the foreword for Christian’s book “The Afterburner Advantage” because they share the same roots in the OODA loop and iterative thinking.
Why Iterative Thinking Doesn’t Come Naturally
“Iterative thinking is not a natural human model. Most of the time we learn from mistakes. We don’t learn as a habit.” — Christian “Boo” Boucousis
Enter e-mail to download a clickable PO Cheat Sheet
This handy Coach Your PO cheat-sheet includes questions to help you define the problem, and links to handy, easy techniques to help you coach your Product Owner
Enter e-mail to download a clickable PO Cheat Sheet
This handy Coach Your PO cheat-sheet includes questions to help you define the problem, and links to handy, easy techniques to help you coach your Product Owner
Enter e-mail to download a checklist to help your PO manage their time
This simple checklist and calendar handout, with a coaching article will help you define the minimum enagement your PO must have with the team
Enter e-mail to download a checklist to help your PO manage their time
This simple checklist and calendar handout, with a coaching article will help you define the minimum enagement your PO must have with the team
Internal Conference
Checklist
Internal Conference
Checklist
Download a detailed How-To to help measure success for your team
Motivate your team with the right metrics, and the right way to visualize and track them. Marcus presents a detailed How-To document based on his experience at The Bungsu Hospital
Download a detailed How-To to help measure success for your team
Read about Visualization and
TRANSFORM
The way your team works
A moving story of how work at the Bungsu Hospital was transformed by a simple tool that you can use to help your team.
Read about Visualization and
TRANSFORM
The way your team works
Overcome Team Resistance and Gain Leadership Buy-In
Discover practical, real-world solutions from leading Agile practitioners. Download three free chapters from 'Tips from the Trenches Scrum Master Edition' and start transforming your Agile practices today!
Overcome Team Resistance and Gain Leadership Buy-In
Discover practical, real-world solutions from leading Agile practitioners. Access three free chapters from 'Tips from the Trenches Scrum Master Edition' and start transforming your Agile practices today!
Overcome Team Resistance and Gain Leadership Buy-In
Discover practical, real-world solutions from leading Agile practitioners.
Download three free chapters from 'Tips from the Trenches Scrum Master Edition' and start transforming your Agile practices today!
FREE! Audiobook Chapters: Overcome Team Resistance and Gain Leadership Buy-In
Download three free chapters from 'Tips from the Trenches Scrum Master Edition' and start transforming your Agile practices today!
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Do you wish you had decades of experience? Learn from the Best Scrum Masters In The World, Today! 
