“You’re not only writing for the leadership—you’re always writing for the gallery.” – Gunnar Fischer
Gunnar brought a juicy challenge to Wednesday: his company is running three transformations in parallel, at three different levels, all at different stages and degrees of success. People are exhausted. The word “change” triggers an allergic reaction. And yet, in the same breath, those same people will tell you the organization needs to change.
So how do you create momentum in a climate worn down by theater and abandoned initiatives, when the managers who launched them have moved on?
Gunnar’s first insight is that the human species is built for change—the problem isn’t appetite, it’s the feeling of not being heard. Even hinting “I think I know your situation, and I took a note from our last conversation” opens people up. Vasco pushes the analysis further: when three transformation teams each visit the same Scrum team with different topics, the team ends up spending all its time discussing transformation instead of doing the work.
Gunnar’s counter is simple math—be realistic that 90% of capacity is work and 10% is learning, plan accordingly, and start small with a single pilot team. He recalls one successful turnaround driven by a “wall of concerns” where leaders read out anonymous worries and answered them publicly. The response didn’t need to be perfect; it just needed to exist.
And the hidden lever is – for example – when you ask a good question in a town hall, you’re not really aiming at leadership; you’re showing hundreds of colleagues “you’re not the only one.” That’s where systemic change actually starts.
In this episode, we refer to Liberating Structures, which Gunnar uses heavily in his change work, and the importance of linking transformation work to bottom-line financials or capability metrics so it survives the next urgent customer request.
Self-reflection Question: In your current change initiative, what visible evidence do people have that leadership is actually listening—not just communicating?
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About Gunnar Fischer
Gunnar is the leader of the Chocolate Guild. Agile practitioner with a software developer background and a strong interest in people, intercultural contacts and the bigger picture. Gunnar’s purpose is to teach and to learn, to grow as a person and to support others who want the same.
You can link with Gunnar Fischer on LinkedIn.
You can also read Gunnar’s writing on his blog, Leader of the Chocolate Guild.
